Darren Beddard Interview

by Marc Strauch

Darren is a spiritual healer, and counsellor with many years of living in, and experiencing grace. He has much to offer all seekers (on any path) who sincerely wish to live in grace. I recently experienced a weekend with Darren and was moved by the experience to share it. I believe an interview with Darren will convey the essence of who he is, and what you might experience with Darren's guidance.

Last November I had the good fortune to meet Darren Beddard via telephone with Donna Love who has known Darren for over 11 years and has watched his personal transformation and evolution. She had been telling me about her friend for quite some time. I was in a turbulent time of my life, and I thought I was doing pretty well at not showing it. Well, it took all of about 30 seconds for Darren to "see" through this and over the telephone gave me feedback clearly describing what I was feeling. "Hmmm....It's not too often that this happens," I thought. "Let's see what else this guy can do" -- mind you, this was not on a psychic or a mind-game level. After a few more "disguised" emotional telephone encounters, where each time Darren in a very clear, direct, and loving but firm manner laid out the emotional cards as he saw them; darned, if he wasn't right-on in each instance. So, a month or so went by , more brief conversations with similar results; then no contact until a Friday morning when Darren left a voice mail message inviting me to Vancouver to share a weekend with him and Athena. Everything fell into place. By Friday night I found myself beginning to experience a very subtle, yet extremely profound transformative experience that I continue to integrate each day since. As soon as the weekend was over Donna and I KNEW we had to share Darren with our friends. Darren is an inspiring spiritual guide as the following interview will show.

Donna: The weekend I had with you on "Spiritual Economics" was certainly a transforming experience for me. How did you begin this work?

Darren: In the early sixties, when I met my first teacher. I'd been through a fair amount of workshops that were oriented toward the business world and success. Always I was left sensing there was more, and something still missing in my life. The greatest shift started at the age of 21, when I had a near death experience, the result of a major contest I experienced between a semi- trailer gravel truck and my pick-up truck.. The pick-up hit the gravel truck head-on and the gravel truck won. I found myself looking down at my body... I didn't know I had a choice to make and I came face to face with that which would be the most significant awareness I would develop in the years to follow , an understanding of our greatest power, that of choice. I was guided to a particular teacher during my convalescent period of nearly six months. I met this teacher who began to open me up with the studies of Concept therapy and the Xoces Process. Then I studied Energy and Man, different courses in Psychology, regressive hypnotherapy, Theosophy, and others. I took many courses under the general subject of the nature of humanity and the nature of psychological forces and how they are formed at and before conception. I looked at the impact of the paradigms that I accepted on many levels and whether those paradigms functioned in this reality or not to keep me free. In my discoveries I saw I had a choice between living a paradigm-driven life, or a principle driven one. As I uncovered the paradigms that were motivating my behavior, both positively and negatively I saw how much was predicated on misunderstandings; little misunderstandings that were either from things not said, experiences not given, or love not expressed in a manner that I demanded to be so. I saw my psyche begin setting itself up... that was the structuring of my ego. Then I focused more attention on that paradigm of ego that humanity shares as a collective.

Donna: Tell me more about your teachers and how they influenced you.

Darren: Gradually these teachers showed me there was much more to life than the motivation for success. Real greatness was experienced when one's Being became integrated. The more I studied, and I still continue these studies after well over 30 years...through conducting workshops, seminars, and counseling. The general theme that exposed itself to me was that there had to be this congruence between the physical, mental, spiritual and emotional bodies. The more I studied the more I realized that if there was any aspect of my being not congruent to the task I was undertaking I experienced failure, at some level. I could complete many tasks, but with mediocrity not with excellence. These studies took me into the mental body and expanding my understanding at the mental level of what motivated my actions. In the summer of 1978, I had an experience with one of my dearest teachers, Dr. Marcus Bach the uncle of Richard Bach of Jonathan Livingston Seagull fame. Marcus Bach, a spiritual giant in my opinion, guided me in a meditation after one of his workshops, and in it I was told most clearly "It is time to withdraw", my first clairaudient experience. Within a year I had no more energy or enthusiasm to build houses, develop land, or to deal in real estate. At that point in time between my entrepreneurial activities, I had been teaching workshops and seminars to the real estate industry called Physio-Dynamics, which taught how to read body language, and how to succeed in sales. That all ended as, in 1979 I had two major experiences which quickened this new direction. They were subsequent to my directive to withdraw. That summer my dad died, and my wife left. I put one son in a boarding school and the other son elected to live with his mother. For the next four and one-half years I lived alone fifty miles from town. I rarely saw anyone. On three or four occasions during those 4 1/2 years I ventured out to teach a workshop. They were recorded on tape, and I was aghast when reviewing them by the overwhelming influence of my ego. I vowed not to return to the outer world until God spoke through me. Significant things began to happen during this retreat. Spiritual teachers appearing in subtle form worked with me for about two years. Jesus and Mary worked with me, Guru Dev, Maharishi's teacher, along with several other Masters including St. Geramin worked with me unbeknownst to me at that time, now I am very close to them. Teachers came to me to offer guidance. So I reviewed my life. Somehow, after about the third year, people began showing up at my door looking for directions to some place or another. The conversation would invariably focus on things like challenges in their lives and a process became evident which has evolved over the years. This process, the result of the integration of gifts developed through years of deep and prolonged meditation resulted with my visitors baring their hearts and their deepest secrets and pains to me. In the experience some change happened, some energetic transfer would occur. Back then I didn't really understand what or how. I do understand the process now, because of other gifts, which gave me the ability to see, hear and think beyond the physical senses. Other senses developed as a result of much infusion of light, and powerful spiritual experiences where the inner being is more readily available to guide my perceptions. At one time as these gifts were beginning to be integrated in me I was told when I could forgive the unforgivable that had occurred to me in my life, and when I completed this process I would then hear the unhearable, see the unseeable, feel the unfeelable, think the unthinkable, and know the unknowable. With great reluctance and against tremendous resistance, I began to study, focusing mostly on a Course In Miracles. A friend, Paul Steinberg, years before was the recipient of a typewritten manuscript from Helen Schucman the scribe who received the information which became the published books called "A Course In Miracles". I successfully completed those 365 lessons in "Grace", and over a period of about 12 years. did the lessons about 10 times from beginning to end ...365 excruciating lessons at first. And the more I did them, the more insights I got into how this ego dynamic worked to create havoc in my life. I left the farm in April 1984 substantially awake and available to Grace. I quickly learned that just because one became illuminated did not mean the end of fear. I knew the difference between those who accepted their divinity and those who did not; and though we still experience fear, we're not paralyzed by it. We still act with integrity, because we get better at walking the razor's edge. That razor's edge is constantly making the choice between love and fear. I began seeing interactions as a call for Love or an extension of It, and came to see more clearly there were really only two emotions, Love and Fear.

Donna: How would you define God and enlightenment?

Darren: Having an intimate experience with the Lord God of my Being was highly personal, something literally indescribable. It's an experience! In A Course In Miracles, it mentions that a universal experience of God is impossible, but an individual experience of God is not only possible, but necessary to bring humanity to the next paradigm, that of Heaven on earth. The masters from India came to America in the thirties and forties through to the eighties, telling us that we are moving toward a Golden Age, the Age of Enlightenment. Through study and personal transformation we see the energy that animates creation, that's called "Vision" as opposed to eyesight, then it is not difficult to understand the principle of A Course In Miracles, which says that everything unlike love will be raised when love comes into the picture. "Love raises everything unlike itself." And as we become conscious, we can sense, we can feel the energy becoming more and more intense throughout humanity. In the collective unconscious of humanity, we can observe daily the pain that is coming to the surface, for us to embrace it to release it forever! When we release the blocks to Love's Presence we're able to give to Love, instead of demand from it. That's the plight of all humanity, to understand that to have the things we want in life, we have to be willing to give to life. The very thing we don't have is the very thing we need to give to life. Another principle of A Course In Miracles focuses clearly on giving and receiving as being one and the same. How can I love you if I don't love myself? What remains then is the journey to Self discovery. Re-discovery in fact. The return to innocence.

Donna: Well, this brings us back to the weekend. I mean, what you're telling me certainly describes some of the experiences that I had with your guidance. Tell us more specifically about what you are doing there.

Darren: Well, the intention of the weekend is to find the blind spots. Each of us has blind spots. including myself, and we continue with certain behaviors, until they are pointed out, until life itself points out that something is not working. This weekend is just a focal point, a little intensification of life itself. But life is the workshop....and your response to it , that's your teacher. All we have to do is just focus our attention a little closer on the results we continue to get, which this weekend does by first creating a clear intention to achieve specific results for the weekend. And as we focus on those intended objectives, the obstacles to receiving and integration come out. You've seen and have experienced the process. I sense no separation between us and can hear the inner child, I can feel the feelings, I sense the energetic emanations from you, and your emotions as the resistance. Because you are in a safe environment you're willing to bring those resistances into the light, with a clear intention to be free.

Marc: Darren, what in your deepest dreams would be your greatest hope that people would get from the workshop when they leave.... how would their lives change.... how would they be instrumental in changing their lives?

Darren: Marc, the one focus of this workshop in fact the universal demand for all of humanity is to accept their Divinity. My personal view and commitment favors the Goddess as the Prime Source of all creation. The womb of creation is the Goddess. I am in awe of Her and my life is dedicated to freeing the goddess so she can to co-create with her divine counterpart, the god within each male. The power struggle between the sexes must end if we are to find peace. Another lesson of A course In Miracles focuses on our holiness.. and , it states "there is nothing my holiness cannot do". Only by accepting our Divinity can we co-create. We go through life functioning from our ego perspective, thinking we have to do this, or that,. thinking we are even doing this or that, when the truth is, that whatever is this "I AM Presence"... that's what is really animating our life. In truth, we can't even breathe on our own. Grace is breathing us... this I AM Presence is breathing our body and the closer we have an association and a partnership with that "I AM Presence", the more flow we have, the easier it is to accomplish anything, because we know Who's doing the work. We get tired when we are efforting to get something done. You heard the phrase in the sixties and early seventies, "I'm in the flow" They were just doing life.... and they were content and happy. They weren't focused on the material, they were focused on happiness. Many were in denial, and went to drugs and psychedelics, which were created by the way to bridge the gap between the intellect which is the child of the ego that blocks the awareness of Love's Presence, and to open up the consciousness to expand it to a general sense of limitlessness. So these psychedelics did have an impact on that generation. Unfortunately, many of that group let the pendulum swing in the opposite direction, and eventually focused too much on the material, and lost their innocence.

Marc: One of the things that I hear you saying, because in your experience you've had numerous teachers, and you've talked about A Course In Miracles quite a bit, there are many people who will read this interview, who may have been following a teacher or a particular path for many years. How would you relate what you're talking about to people who are not just are on a spiritual path, but are following a particular teacher or teaching and what people would learn experiencing a weekend with you .

Darren: At the heart of every teaching is truth. All religions have aspects of truth.. all of the paths are valid. Again, A Course In Miracles suggests that "all things are lessons God would have me learn". All events of our life, are here by our invitation. Nothing ever comes unbidden to us. There is no path more valid than another. If one chooses Christianity, Buddhism, or any other path with an intention to grow (because the intention behind the activity is what's sacred or profane) the result will always be Truth and an increased capacity to Love as long as the intent is innocent.

Marc: How does one distinguish between being in ego and an egoless action?

Darren: It is my personal view, being without an ego in this third dimension is not realistic. The concept is too limiting and at first seems insurmountable to most seekers. We are wearing our egos. What may be more realistic in my view is to bring the ego into a position of service to the Higher Self. Didn't your teacher, Maharishi say,..(your into TM aren't you?) Maharishi Mahesh Yogi told you to take your ego and expand it to universality. He didn't say destroy your ego--that's an action of the ego itself! It's like beating yourself... self flagellation -- that's the ego striking you, amplifying its control over you. Jesus said this very clearly "resist ye not evil, or the appearances thereof." And the ego is not to be resisted. We are to work with it,- through it. You'll not destroy your ego, you'll just build it stronger by resisting it. Its easier to do an Aikido move on its impulses. Be the "willow in the wind" - not the oak in the hurricane.

Donna: You mentioned accepting your divinity. That seems like it would be a really good title for the weekend experience. That's what my experience was. Its beautiful.

Darren: Well the Art of Miracles is accepting your Divinity.

Marc: This brings up the same point around ego... can you accept your Divinity with intellect and your ego? How does one know that they are accepting their divinity from their deep Presence within, or how do they know if they are accepting it at the ego level, if sometimes there's distinction... I mean is there a clear knowingness that one has within when that point is reached at deeper levels?

Darren: Did you not both experience a breakthrough on the weekend? (Donna: Yes; Marc: Yes). The end result was joy .. the end result is always more Grace... in fact what you were doing in this weekend was giving birth. Donna, you have a child.. you've given birth. Was it fun?

Donna (laughter): I don't think so.

Darren: Was the result fun?

Donna: The result was fun... the result was joy.

Darren: More joy that you have ever experienced.. You trusted the process and the result was Grace.

Donna: Yes

Darren: Why? Because you experienced freedom. Birthing seems to be a challenging experience, while death is the easiest and we all choose death over and over in our life. In the workshop, there is both a birthing and a death. The death of old paradigms. Sometimes we are so attached to these old, these antiquated paradigms that they don't leave without a bit of resistance. There is a way, in this workshop, to have them leave with very little resistance. Now Marc, you were witness to a man who was suffering physically in the workshop with great discomfort. With a little bit of energy work the discomfort left his body, he didn't writhe in pain did he?

Marc: No

Darren: It was gentle, and it was effortless, because his willingness, his intention to clear this energy, the block, was to do it effortlessly, and in proportion to his willingness he had an effortless release. If there is resistance to releasing, that resistance in proportion to the intensity is how we view the release of the thought form and the integration of another aspect of the fractured self. The weekend focuses us on the price we pay for selling out, for choosing death... for selling out on the God/Goddess of our Being. Humanity is quite predictable and as a rule unless there is enough pain to cause change, we resist it. We're satisfied with the status quo. Participants who choose to experience this weekend have had enough of the resistance. They say "I don't want a J-O-B anymore. I want my life back. I want to live my life in my divinity, and I want Grace to be my guide." They learn to follow the energy once their intention is clear about where they're going. They learn to trust the Energy that animates this whole universe. It does so in a much better fashion than they ever could. The Intelligence they access, through this process, they learn to trust It to guide them to the ultimate destination, home. First they get to know what their purpose is, by doing some clearing work so they can access through guided meditations--deep guided meditations-- They can find their Higher Self and join with it. In this process the Higher Self will typically, through various forms of communication show what the true life purpose is provided the individual is ready to know. We will understand many principles that function in our lives--consciously or unconsciously those principles are running our life, with or without our permission.. We can either live by the table scraps of entropy, or we can learn to consciously co-create our reality.. This workshop is about consciously creating our reality. We learn how to focus and with a clear sense of direction life becomes more of an adventure than a series of catastrophes or dull and boring events.

Donna: Quite beautiful... everything is perfect. Laughter.......

Marc: You know, Maharishi often talks about the path to higher states of awareness as peeling the layers of an onion; it's not like you are ever really complete, you're always just peeling it back until you get to the eternal Self, so in all of this what is the value of the emotional healing in being able to get to that, even if it is the same experience. Is there a point, say if you have had a traumatic experience in your life and you go through several layers of peeling back the trauma of that, dealing with it at various levels of intensity. At what level can you sense that you are done with it and ready to move on? How do you know that? Is it a very deep intuitive feeling?

Darren: It is a Knowing. The experience is released from the nervous system. Not the memory of it, just the influence from our perception of its negative control on our ability to perform in life by Grace. Wisdom is the result of understanding gleaned from integration of our experiences, which result from having gained the insights through these processes.

Marc: What about having it all?

Darren: Some teachers today inspiring their students, would say you can have it all. Let's put that concept to test. For example, I want to be a world class entrepreneur. I also want to be the President of the United States. I also want to be a basket ball pro.. I've always loved basketball. and I want to be a world class guitarist. That's only four things. That's not even having it all. That's just four things. in reality when we examine the amount of discipline and dedication required to be a world class performing star, President of the United States, a top flight professional basketball player, under the heading of you can have it all, it's not realistic. I believe individuals may be led away from their highest purpose. I believe, having it all means, having a connection between the physical, mental, spiritual and emotional bodies that allows us access to our divinity, clearly knowing our purpose, our life mission so to speak, and co-creating with our Higher Self, from a functional awareness of our divinity, what's required in the third dimension to anchor the understanding and attract the tools necessary to carry out our mission.

Marc: Why do we so often fail to carry out our intentions?

Darren: Because some aspect of our being is not congruent to the task. Let's look at an example of physical, mental, spiritual and emotional congruence, and how it's required for a successful life. For instance, your intention is to swim the English Channel. If the four bodies, the physical, mental, spiritual and emotional bodies are congruent to the task, you'll get to the other side. But lets suppose the mental body is out of alignment. What's required to come into alignment with the mental body is the knowledge of where the other side of the English Channel is. You have to understand the direction, to know what the destination is mentally, and if you lack a sense of direction and you set out on the open water, and you swim and swim and swim, and you find yourself in the middle of the Atlantic, chances of getting to your goal are pretty slim; and so the mental body is not congruent to the task. Let's take the next level, congruence of the physical body. Here you are with a deficiency in the physical body. You've got one leg, no arms and weak lungs. The chances of you fulfilling the mission of swimming the English Channel are pretty slim, and you're going to meet with a bit of difficulty, since physical body may not be up to the task. Now, let's look at the spiritual body. If the Spirit doesn't move you, and your motivation for the choice is egocentric you'll have to express...you'll be required to express enormous amounts of effort to do that because, again, an aspect of your being is not congruent to the task. That choice is not in alignment with what you are here to do. And so making effort, and pushing the flow, pushing the river will consume more energy than is available. So the spiritual body must be congruent to the task of being an English Channel swimmer. And finally let's look at the emotional body. Here's what causes most failures in our their lives. Failure is often an act of seeking revenge on some past influence in our life. In the emotional body are the blocks to excellence. In the emotional body is the resistance to all aspects of producing and performing with excellence. So now, the intention is to swim the English Channel, but somewhere in the emotional body, your child at the age of four years old experienced a trauma in a swimming pool where one of your friends came up from underneath and grabbed you and pulled you under. In that very experience is emotional trauma. Let's say you choked on a mouthful of water and experienced intense fear of drowning. The fright and the energy, the emotional impact of that experience has never be released from your physical, or emotional body although the experience is long forgotten. Now you set out on the English Channel and you swim out a distance and a big wave hits you in the face and you swallow some water. The memory of your past experience is activated and the emotional body kicks in. All of a sudden there it is a memory... subtle, it's faint, but it's there. Now the circumstances, conditions and environment are ripe for recreating the emotional impact of the swimming pool experience and fear overwhelms you. In life fear cripples performance. Now the emotional body is not congruent to the task, and you get a cramp where the energy of that trauma is stored, panic sets in and you call out to be lifted into the rowboat, having failed your attempt. Now do you see how all four bodies have to be congruent to the task?

Marc: Absolutely. Sometimes it seems for many people that we don't know what those emotional blockages are. That even if all of the other bodies are in alignment, that sometimes we don't know what the emotional blockage is, and sometimes we have dealt with that, and we are going along in a certain direction and we don't get there, its perhaps because its not in our own best interest, so how would one explain that? How would the weekend experience deal with something like that in their life, where they've tried to do something very particular, they have been very focused on it, they have the right training, so forth and so on and they don't get support in their environment to do what they have set out to do? How will you help them either to achieve it or to redirect themselves?

Darren: First of all. We dealt with it earlier to some degree. The Higher Self has a purpose for our incarnation, others, like moms and dads, or teachers and friends even though well intended attempt to mold our direction without knowing what we are really here to do and attempt to have us live out their idea of what our lives should be like. Trauma happens in people's lives because they are not in alignment with their purpose or they create Self Inflicted Nonsense (SIN) to prove a belief imposed or accepted that they are not worthy of Love, either in the form of achievement or whatever. So the Higher Self, says "Hey, I want your attention!" then we experience a car accident, or a minor trauma, even the subtlest thing such as cutting your finger because you are not focused, or because you might need to be doing something aside from cutting carrots. The energies of life itself will direct us relative to our clarity of intention. When that intention is congruent to our life purpose, we produce and perform with very little effort. Over the weekend, we do processes that are very carefully designed to bring us to the awareness, first of all, for what we are here to do, and how best to achieve it. Now, not everyone is ready step into their grace. But the greatest fear... Nelson Mandela, who I believe to be a very enlightened man, said, "we're not afraid of all of these external experiences.. the greatest fear man has is of his greatness." And, we block that greatness. In this weekend, we discover, or we re-discover our innocence. The innocence that our child had before it began to shut down because it didn't receive love, or someone didn't know how to direct love properly. We undo the blocks to living in a state of grace. Have I answered you question?

Marc: Yes. You did discuss it before and this just makes it so much clearer.. Donna?

Donna: I don't have any further questions. You've covered so much ground here and to end with the quote from the operating theory of interfering with our own greatness. That was certainly, the realization that came to me while experiencing the weekend with you. To accept my divinity, I realized I also had to take complete responsibility for all of my creations from then on and, that 's (a tremendous laughter) ...that's a big choice.

Darren: In the middle eighties, humanity as a collective, agreed for the first time in history. to turn the bend towards coming home. Where once we left heaven, once we left the home of the truth of our Being; the beginning of our consciousness as a collective of humans, we had no responsibility, total dependence, and where we are going in the collective right now is to absolute responsibility, total consciousness - completely aware and completely responsible, accountable, and interdependent and whole. We experience how to really integrate those aspects of our being, how to recapture those fragments, re integrate the fragments, into wholeness.

Donna: Beautiful. It really sounds like anyone who is interested in more harmony, or any improvement in their life would really benefit from a weekend with you no matter what they have been doing on their different paths.

Darren: When everything seems to be falling apart in our lives, what a person does is usually react from fear and exert more control. If we take a moment, and take a couple of deep breaths and realize that things are falling apart for a purpose, that what we are doing is not working, it's time now to find out, what we are really supposed to be doing. If life isn't working... if we keep getting the same results .. if we're into our second , or third or fourth marriage and we keep creating relationships that don't work then sooner or later we have to take responsibility, to be the cause..."I am the common denominator in my pain, and I want to take responsibility for that by saying "I own my life. If I created rape in my life, if I created havoc in any area of my life, I created it." The most difficult challenge humans have, is to take responsibility, to be accountable. Their lives are unfolding lawfully in accordance with the Law of Magnetic Attraction. The laws of the universe are not respectors of persons. We attract into our lives that which we are magnetically polarized to. If I'm afraid of an assault, I'm going to experience one. I'm going to attract it to me, energetically, like two horseshoe magnets. I am polarized through my fears, or my love to attract into my life those experiences congruent to my focus of energy consciously realized or not. If I only believe in attracting loving people into my life, I attract loving people into my life. If I believe in success and wealth, then I'm going to attract success and wealth, and I'm going to function within the understanding of those laws of life--as I give, so shall I receive.. as you sow, so shall ye reap. We forget the laws are simple. They have been here since time immemorial. The laws are the same for everyone, they are not going to change. As soon as we get a greater understanding of those laws we can slip into more harmony, do it effortlessly. Without integrating ourselves and venturing forward-- with grace--and as we learn how to follow the energy, and actually understand how our thoughts and words create our reality, and also how with the power of change we can harness and move toward consciously co-creating with God/Goddess we'll condemn our future generations to more chaos and entropy if we don't take responsibility now and focus on creating heaven on earth.

Marc: It's a pretty ultimate conclusion.

Darren It's inevitable. We can postpone Grace but there's no such thing as postponing Grace forever; it will still be around. Sooner or later we all achieve it. Over the weekend we focus on achieving it sooner. Why? Because, we want to have a little more fun. No matter what universe I've scanned, and I've played in the Etheric realms, and I'm told by the Masters, it's the most universal theme, and the greatest of difficulties in all the universes focus around this one challenge, how to have fun. When you are in the flow, you are having fun, and when you are not having fun something has gone wrong. So, the miracle impulse is what we want to attune to and as a result of such an intense focus on the miracle impulse during this weekend, we have a chance to see, feel, and actually sense the energy that wants to guide us. So, we are going to learn some profound lessons in communicating with the Divine. Anytime there is a break down in our association with another human being or an animal pet.. it is because we fail to communicate. We fail to be empathetic to the needs, wants, or desires of the other being, and we want to force our reality onto other people, instead of understanding, "this is what I want", here's what you want, how do we both get what we want. Well, I can't figure it out.. you can't figure it, cause we're both in this dynamic power struggle to get what we want and we're not willing to play the win-win game, so we play win-lose, lose-win or lose-lose. We give up, and we become victor , victim, or martyr, and we go into these silly roles that consistently disappoint us. The focus of our lives must be to constantly ask for guidance from our divinity.... "How can I make You win and How can I win with You?" By giving that, I always get it.

Donna: Thank you Darren, I believe you did more than we expected today in describing your workshop, and your background.